Here's a good one?

[Daver80]

I'll try this site, might have some cross over members.
I've got an 80 spider FI, it starts, runs for 2 seconds and dies, appears to start very well the colder it is, but runs for only 2 seconds.
Last Nov, while driving, died. pulled over started again ran for a few houses and died, needed a tow
A week later started, took it out for a last boot before winter, at 40 mph died with a hot engine, needed a tow
FF 3 weeks ago tried starting no luck, came out 2 weeks ago, started ran around the block for 10 min and parked it. Tried it 5 hours later, starts and stops again. Jiggled the ignition wires and it started and ran(a couple of days ago) but back to the same ol thing.
Whats been checked - another AFM - new double relay from 5 years ago, tried the old one too - cold start sprays fuel -aux air valve is not plugged - no major cracks in any of the vac hoses(can't see any actually) - new coil/pickup/control module - coolant temp sensor at tee is correct ohms - double relay checks out for voltage - flap in AFM activates fuel pump - appears all the grounds are connected - jumped the ignition switch and still no difference - and for the kicker that is probably throwing me off.... if I disconnect the AFM and leave it open and unplugged, the car starts and runs, you have to feather the throttle, but it will rev as high as you want to and idle all day.
Haven't tried another cpu or noid light on the injectors
Gas pedal appears dead the 2 seconds it runs
If anyone has had a problem like this? Let me know if you got it fixed

Thanks Dave

[Daver80]

Forgot - If I jam a screwdriver in the AFM it will start and run, but you have to operate the flap and throttle cable together to rev the engine, too much of one or the other and it dies.

Dave

[launieg]

You don't mention if the throttle position switch has been checked. It could be loose or not set right. It's easy to check and adjust. Set wrong or loose, it can shut down the injectors. Just a thought

[Daver80]

Well now that you mention TPS, the cap to it fell off a couple years ago and the inside is subject to the under hood conditions. The cherry switch inside does click when you move it slightly

Dave

[launieg]

It should click "just as" you open the throttle and then click again just as you close it, but it should not move unless the throttle moves. It does need to be set right too, so that it "clicks" or opens the circuit at the right time. And of course the wiring harness and connnector to it must be undamaged. You'll find directions in Artigue's engine maintenance and modification manual and most other manuals too. It could be malfunctioning due to having no cap I suppose.

[Daver80]

Hey thanks for the advice, but I checked the tps and it works properly even put an ohm meter on it. So the cherry switch inside is working properly.
Fixed a couple of shakey grounds but that wasn't the problem either.
pulled a spark plug wire and watched for spark - it sparks the whole 2 seconds the engine is running
seems to me that the injectors are not firing
I have hot wired the fuel pump and had it constantly going and it still dies after 2 seconds
I've talked to 8 people about this with no luck
alot of ideas but nothing yet?
might be too far down in the posts for anyone to see now?

Thanks Dave

[rlux4]

Dave, you say it seems like the injectors aren't pulsing. To trouble shoot your problem you'd need to verify if they are or not.
The best way to do this is with a noid light. One can be bought or borrowed from Autozone pretty cheaply. They work a lot better than a test light or a volt meter for checking injector pulse. Unless we know if your injectors are or aren't pulsing it's impossible to know what the problem is.
How did you hot wire the fuel pump? If you tapped into the dual relay inline fuse (brown with white stripe wire) then you're loosing power because of a faulty fuse holder. The factory fuse holder is not designed very well, it can loose good contact with the fuse at the ends and you'd never know it. I replaced mine with a standard AGC type holder and it eliminated the intermittent loss of power to the fuel pump. If you don't know where it is, it's up behind the fuse panel in the rat's nest of wires. It's sometimes hard to find, but it's there. Look for the dark brown wire with a white stripe and pull it down to reveal the fuse holder.
Ron

[Daver80]

Thanks for your reply:
The reason I felt the injectors are not "turning on" or pulsing is because I pulled a plug wire and started the car. The 2 seconds it runs, the spark is jumping out of the wire till it dies; and it seems it is only running on the cold start valve.
Going to rent a noid light tomorrow and try that(work permitting)
As for the fuel pump, I ran a line from the + side of the pump straight to the pos side of the battery. So it was constantly going.
5 or 6 years ago the car died, pump wasn't working, no gas couldn't figure it out? (wasn't connected to internet unfortunately) Guy at International auto parts in Virginia told me over and over again that all the fuses in the car were in the fuse box only. haha sure. At this time ordered a new double relay and 3 trouble shooting manuals. Then called Bosch in Minn., guy there told me about the "extra fuse" for the pump. Well hey guess what was melted down ??? Fixed that and a week later the double fuse and manuals came in.

Ya know though, one guy said 3 weeks turn into 3 years and soon you have a nice looking parts car.

[MNspiderman]

I had the same problems, turned out the ecu went bad. wasn't telling the combi relay what to do so in turn the fuel pump wouldn't go on when it was suppose to. I didn't want to spend ANOTHER $100 bux but eventually when I did. Thank God, that was the problem. In fact it fixed a few other problems related to how the engine ran.

[Daver80]

Rented the noid light, the injectors are firing. Checked for continuity for all the wires coming from the AFM to the double relay - all wires checked out, tried hot wiring the pump( running constantly) still dies.
Only thing left? in the process of acquiring a CPU only thing left I guess.
The colder the engine the quicker it starts, almost immediately..still only 2 seconds at a time

Dave

[zachmac]

Rented the noid light, the injectors are firing. Checked for continuity for all the wires coming from the AFM to the double relay - all wires checked out, tried hot wiring the pump( running constantly) still dies.
Only thing left? in the process of acquiring a CPU only thing left I guess.
The colder the engine the quicker it starts, almost immediately..still only 2 seconds at a time

Dave

Dave,

I thought I was out of the woods with my electrical woes (see my thread on also dead) but today when I tried to actually run the car to move it it does exactly what you are describing, starts instantly, runs about two seconds and dies! I'll be going through the same routines. I hope YOU figure it out!

BTW, my car ran FINE until I decided to take it apart to clean and paint the intake plenum and injectors, etc. I put it all back together and now this!

[zachmac]

My car is FIXED! It turned out that all I needed to do was go ahead and make up a permanent, tight connection feed to F10 and all the other symptoms went away! I cannot stress enough checking all your ground and power feed connections. My car would read battery voltage UNTIL you load the system and then voltage would go to squat. Even when I jumpered the feed to F10, the connection wasn't good enough to feed the pump relay (even though the car would start) and once I released the key it would die as the pump would quit running.

The "cranking" position picks up the relay fuel pump relay via a different path than the "on" position of the ignition switch. The car will start on the cold start relay and run as long as you keep cranking but die shortly after you release the key.

When you said you jumpered the pump, how did you do it. If you jumpered from the supply in the car a high impedance problem like I had will still keep the pump from running.

You may want to read this article: http://www.hiperformancestore.com/Ljetronic.htm. It is for an Alfa but it is 99% the same as our cars and ewhere it is difference is easily understood. Bradley's writeup is okay but this is much better.

[abo1010]

Do you have photos? Or can you explain in more details please. I have same issue