dinghyguy's restoration of "Mark"

[dinghyguy]

Hello all,
Yes Mark is still in existence, and still in need of some restoration work. I have driven the car regularly winter and summer, but never in the rain, but the rust on the rear wheel arches is getting to me.
So since i last posted in this thread I built a 25x30 2 bay garage to replace the "too small garage" added a 4 post lift and filled the garage with two fiats and a volvo 1800es.

But now it is time to get back at it! My initial tasks were planned to be changing the Vacuum advance module and the front shock........no big deal right? So friday night i went ot our local car gathering in the Canadian Tire parking lot with one of the other local fiat nuts and his car. Had a milkshake and looked at all the hot rods and american iron. Then got back in the car to drive home. About half way home and half way up the hills in my neighborhood i feel a snap and find the clutch pedal basically on the floor. Well with some careful use of the "rolling stop" i got the car home. So now my vacuum advance project includes a clutch cable replacement (if the firewall is not craccked) sigh. Some searching around and i determine i need to order the clutch cable from the usual vendors, well if that is the case, might as well get a timing belt and do that too since the last time was 2007, but dont forget the idler pulley and shipping. So after the FEDEX robbery charges for stuff across the border and canadian taxes i am out about 150$Can. But hey i already have the water pump, belt and hoses on site so it could be worse.

So lets do the easy jobs first, the vacuum advance. I did the one on the other fiat a week or so ago no problems expected....yea right! take it apart put the new one on, remount the dizzy in the same place and no start, not even a hint of wanting to start. The timing light flickers, then stops. The other timing light does not flicker either. So my conclusion is that the ignition is not firing. It was late, so i stopped for the evening.

This is still a mystery, but i am guessing a broken wire in the electronics in the dizzy from my handling, but i have a spare so this weekend. Aditional info is that the rotor and cap look excellent. My plan is to swap the ignition module, and see if that helps. Once i get a spark happening i expect all will be well and then i will just set the timing.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

Cheers
dinghyguy in the new crowded garage

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Dinghyguy in the new crowded garage, formerly known as Dinghyguy in the too small garage:

If you had a spark, even if timed incorrectly, your timing light would flash. Since it is not flashing, you have no spark. I'd start with checking the low voltage connections to your distributor. It could be a loose wire, or maybe you blew out the electronics in the distributor for unknown reasons. Let us know what you find with swapping the ignition module.

-Bryan, the Doofus who still uses points because he is old school.

[dinghyguy]

Well another day of fiat fun in the too full garage,

Got the vacuum advance issue and timing all sorted out, yes it appeared to be the sensor in the dizzy. I replaced it, set the timing per the manual and varoom, off it went. Even cleaned and lubed the cetrifgul advance mechanism whil i was at it. Not the car runs nicely.

Next was the exploration of the clutch cable.

Remove the nuts on the clutch end - easy
Remove the seat - easy
Remove the steering wheel - easy
Disconnect the clutch cable - not possible.......no way no how.

Alas the dreaded firewall failure!

Move the brake reservoir out of the way - easy
move the assorted cables across the top out of the ay - easy
Try and pull, wiggle cable out - not possible, sigh.
back into the car, lie down and impatiently install about a million dollars of quarters in the return spring on the pedal - hard but eventually get the spring off
again try wiggling and mucking about with cable - still no success.
Remove pivot bolt holding brake and clutch peal in place (well almost cause the bolt is on the short side and it hits stuff) - not too bad
with clutch pedal loose disconnect cable and remove it - easy

But now i need to fabricate a patch about 8" wide by 3" high spanning from the drain pipe to the accelerator cable and from the brake booster up.to the underside of the dash - still to be done with a template and some sheet metal.

Todays question - if i clean the paint off does anyone see a reason not to use some body adhesive and two pop rivets to hold the new plate in place instead of trying weld in there?

Regardless i will still need to remove the carb to get access and perhaps even the brake booster.

cheers
dinghyguy upside down under the dash for way too long

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Well, good news on the ignition. On the clutch cable.... Did you get the cable removed?

Replacing a clutch cable on a spider is in my "Top Five least favorite Fiat repair jobs", and the reason is that stupid half-moon shaped clip at the end of the cable, the one that inserts into the fork at the end of the clutch pedal. Unless you have small hands, the job is almost impossible.

I use a bungee cord to hold the clutch pedal in the full up position, but still able to depress a bit if needed. Lying on my back in the space where the seat used to be, I reach up on both sides of the pedal box to where the cable attached to the fork in the pedal, and by feel, move it around until it pops free. Sometimes depressing the pedal a bit helps. Installing a new cable is a similar process although typically more time consuming.

But back to the firewall issue. Do you know that yours is cracked, or was it just a broken clutch cable? If it's not cracked, I wouldn't mess with it, but the fact that you've already done all this prep work would seem to indicate that you think it's cracked. Welding a new plate in there is the optimal solution, but it does require removing the brake booster and lots of other stuff as you mention. I'm not familiar with adhesives for this purpose, but I agree with you that you likely need clean unpainted metal for it to stick. Any chance of getting more than 2 rivets in there?

Well, it seems like I've written a lot but really haven't answered your questions. So, let me know what you're thinking and we'll go from there.

-Bryan

[dinghyguy]

The firewall is more than cracked.......the clutch piece is barely attached to anything, he metal over to the speedo cable is broken and the other way almost to the plenum drain, about a 6x2.5 hole if it were square.

Plan is to make a patch piece, glue or tack the original clutch flange onto the part drill the hole, drill a new hole for the Speedo cable and then attach the whole thing to the firewall.

Then i can try and figure out how to reassemble the clutch pedal and new cable......

all should be done by christmas given the hassle of the disassembly, maybe i should look for a snow plow to add as well.

In fact i am thinking of removing the engine since i was going to do the timing belt and a new fuel pump anyhow........

I think i just became the poster boy for scope creep.....

dinghyguy

[wetminkey]

Holy crap, Dan-O! I'm so sorry to see that you are struggling (and I thought I was having difficulties,..!). I can tell what kind of fun you are having,...
OK. So THIS deserves yanking the engine,...then you can access the firewall easily. Sounds like you may have been considering that anyway.
Dude, you are going to need to line up someone to weld-in a patch-plate (it should NOT be that hard in Vancouver). Even I can manage that, twenty miles from no-where. They can come to you, or take it to them,...it will give you a nice repair.
The very best of luck with it all - I can sympathize,...from recent experience!
Later, Todd.

[dinghyguy]

Thanks Todd,

Really it does not look that insurmountable, to patch with the engine in place. I am thinking of using permatex metal epoxy to hold the patch in place since the area is a challenge to get good access to weld without removing the carb, intake manifold, brake booster , some wiring and brake lines. I have the metal lined up, just need to get it and start the fab work.

So todays question, has anyone used Permatex metal epoxy to install a patch panel?

cheers
dinghyguy

[spider2081]

the clutch piece is barely attached to anything, he metal over to the speedo cable is broken and the other way almost to the plenum drain, about a 6x2.5 hole if it were square.

How about getting a section of used firewall from someone who is junking a shell Wouldn't hurt to ask in "parts wanted section"

[dinghyguy]

Excellent idea, thanks. I will try it and see what happens.....

cheers
Dinghyguy

[dinghyguy]

Well the firewall repair is complete, see below

[18Fiatsandcounting]

That's great work Dinghyguy, both in terms of the quality of the repair as well as the documentation. Thanks for the summary!

-Bryan