Restoring Original Parts vs Replacing With New

[AlexD]

I’ve enjoyed reading over the past year about all the great restorations, repairs, and general knowledge sharing from everyone on the site. I’ve learned a lot and have a lot more to learn and I’m looking forward to finally starting to turn wrenches on my 1980 fuel injected spider. I’ve spent some time underneath the car this past week changing the oil and started to make a list of projects that I want to do now and over the winter. One of the projects on the shortlist is the suspension - both front and rear - as things like bushings, ball joints, and shocks/springs all need the typical attention that I know will make the ride even more comfortable and enjoyable.

This got me thinking about what to repair or restore and what to replace. I really like the idea for some reason of keeping the car as original as possible. I know that some parts absolutely wear out beyond repair or beyond their function and need to be replaced but there are other parts like the a arms and other pieces that if not compromised can be restored repainted and put back on the car. I’m curious from those who have been through this many more times than me what your general thoughts are about keeping the car as original as possible versus replacing completely for the sake of ease and time. I don’t mind sweat equity but there’s a point where working smarter beats working harder. This is no way it’s going to be a show car and while I have no plans to sell, I do look at the car as an investment.

Thoughts from the smarter and more knowledgeable folks around here?

Thanks!

[toyfiats]

Great question, as it's one I've wrestled with for years. I was originally of the 'replace-everything, make everything brand' new camp, but quickly realized that in a lot of cases the quality of replacement parts were inferior to the originals (this was more the case in the '90s, hopefully things have improved). I've gradually move over to the 'restore-versus-replace' mindset, to the extent I am able to do the work myself or know of someone offering a service to do so.

Control arms are a great example. Unless they are rusted, cracked, or bent the originals are very solid and were of a heavier gauge, or at least more stoutly built, than aftermarket pieces (which varied by manufacturer), and can be rebuilt to as good as new. That's the route I took, although just buying replacements would have been 10X easier and quicker. In this case I didn't have a press for the bushings, so I had a shop do that, but I stripped and repainted them.

On the other hand, my rear brake calipers began to seize, and while they can be rebuilt I've seen posts on it and didn't feel comfortable with my abilities to do so (having gone so far as disassembling them). In the end I bough brand new, not rebuilt, replacements, which had the benefit of a slightly larger piston. They were a little more fiddly to install (handbrake cable especially), but that is not unheard of for replacement rather than original parts.

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Thoughts from the smarter and more knowledgeable folks around here?

I don't fall in this category, but I'll give you my opinions anyway.

I tend to rebuild old parts rather than simply replace, for the reasons toyfiats mentioned above. Obviously, this doesn't apply to to oil rings or water pumps or ball joints, but I have found the original components to be better quality than some of the aftermarket replacements. An example is an oil pump: An original, as long as it meets the spec, is going to be of better quality than some of the aftermarket alternatives. Another example is the early style external voltage regulator. They can be cleaned and adjusted, and will likely be better than a modern version. (an exception would be if you go with an alternator upgrade which has the internal voltage regulator)

The other factor is that I restore "old stuff" as a hobby, and often if you can't fix the original part, you're out of luck because there is no modern replacement. Wanna fix the cracked dial on that rare 1930s Zenith radio? Better make friends with your local clock repair shop and learn to cut holes in glass, as no replacement dial glass is available.

The original design of the spiders was very robust, and it was one of the longest runs of a passenger vehicle without any major changes. What doomed Fiat spiders was rust issues, spotty dealer service, changing tastes, and the Datsun 240Z.

So, restore to original as best you can, enjoy it for the 40 or 50 year car that it is, and have fun!

-Bryan

[pwilliam]

Any after market part ordered, that comes with a coat of paint, deserves at least one more coat of paint. Think control arms, gas tanks, trailing arms and so on. I think they get a single coat before they are shipped and if you don’t repaint them they will look worse than the pieces you are replacing in no time. I’ve had new control arms look worse than originals in as little as a year, because I didn’t add another coat of paint.

[TX82FIAT]

I think the replacement parts quality has improved greatly over the last 15 years. Similar to replacing a Sipea ignition switch with a Lada, you really did not know what you might get in the past. It is true some of the replacement parts simply were not good quality. However, there are some newer parts or modifications that are better than the OEM parts. For example, installing relays improves and preserves the electricals. The steering idler arm with bearings has been great for 10 years now. The rear taillight replacement circuit boards on the spider 2000 have eliminated the cleaning and even soldering. The list goes on and on like converting points. So, I would say be familiar with the parts and ask the people on this forum about the specific part you want to change or upgrade. The FIAT folks here know their stuff and will shoot you straight on refurbishing old vs buying new. I think the question is really part specific.

[AlexD]

Thanks for the replies and commentary - much appreciated.

[quote]Control arms are a great example. Unless they are rusted, cracked, or bent the originals are very solid and were of a heavier gauge, or at least more stoutly built, than aftermarket pieces (which varied by manufacturer), and can be rebuilt to as good as new. That's the route I took, although just buying replacements would have been 10X easier and quicker. In this case I didn't have a press for the bushings, so I had a shop do that, but I stripped and repainted them./quote]

The control arms were exactly the part that got my wheels turning - why not just strip them down and refinish them if they're solid? Replacing the bushings, etc is challenging but absolutely possible.

[quote]So, restore to original as best you can, enjoy it for the 40 or 50 year car that it is, and have fun!/quote]

That's where my head is as well - good plan!

[quote]Any after market part ordered, that comes with a coat of paint, deserves at least one more coat of paint./quote]

That's a great point and something I hadn't thought of. Thanks for the tip!

[quote]So, I would say be familiar with the parts and ask the people on this forum about the specific part you want to change or upgrade. The FIAT folks here know their stuff and will shoot you straight on refurbishing old vs buying new. I think the question is really part specific./quote]

100% agree - will absolutely be leveraging the experts here for advise (and hope to be able to give some advice back eventually).

Fiat on, all!

[davidbruce]

Alex you seem to be on a good path. When I did my suspension I rebuilt everything that was solid for a couple of reasons. First is that shipping from the states to Canada gets expensive and bushings are a lot smaller and lighter than a arms and trailing arms. Not whining, just stating a fact. Secondly, I bought my car as a retirement project so it only makes sense for me. Lastly I have a reasonably well equipped shop. If I had to chase down pieces of tubing for pushing/pulling bushings it may not have been worth it. I was able to remove/replace them all with tubing,sockets,threaded rods and a vise that I had on hand. I had a machinist friend make me stainless front caliper pistons to replace the rusty ones I had. Cheaper than new calipers and they should outlast me by a good margin. That being said I think the replacements the venders have are good value if you need more than a seal kit. I think only we can decide what makes the most sense for our own situation.