Crossmember studs/frame reinforcement

[wetminkey]

Long story, short - finally finished the car's mechanical and interior (after about twenty years of ownership),...out for alignment - won't hold the camber setting. Turns out that the unibody frame rail has small cracks, just in the area of the crossmember attachment to it's studs. I've heard of it before, but this can hardly be seen,...
Yipes! So,...Found a few great designs on this forum, and chose to copy DRUMMOND's, because I like the engineering best. He states that it was a reinforcement done to the Abarth Spiders, and I can see why. More on that as things progress,...
I lined up my buddy's rig for towing, and a professional frame/body man (and shop owner) that's a friend of mine, to do the work. And waited for 'the call'.
Pulled the 2 liter, and left it supported, but dangling. Waited for a call from my frame guy for so long, that I pulled the TH180 tranny out (for a cleaning and re-seal) on Weds., because nothing was supposed to happen this week. And then I suddenly got a call this morning, from the owner of the frame shop, Brady, wondering if I could bring the car in today!

With my buddy's generous help, and tow-rig, we got the car there by noonish, and I began teardown of the front end.
Anyway, I got most of the front end apart, but I have to look further to see if I have a pair of external spring compressors - what I took today was my MacPherson strut compressors, and I could not get them to fit. I think that when I did this, twenty years ago, I simply raised the suspension part way with my jack, wired the spring tightly, in that position, and then lowered my jack. I just left the spring compressed while I replaced control arms,...I would sure rather store them uncompressed!
Otherwise, most everything else slightly loosened without too much trouble. I was able to easily 'break' one tie-rod end, but the passenger's side has become Morse taper PITA!
I look forward to inspecting the crossmemeber for cracks, as you can well imagine.
I hope to have lots of pics when I have the damage uncovered. So, lots more soon.
Todd.

[wetminkey]

Friends are a wonderful thing,...I now have a pair of external spring compressors, and some items to assist with the tie-rod end. The shop will be open in the AM,...
I mentioned DRUMMOND's framerail repair, using "through bolts",...this is a pic, from above:

and here's my 'rough' of the design, with some measurements and plate gauges:

I have yet to determine exactly how large of a bolt I can get through the crossmember,...and I'll determine actual length once I have full access to the framerail. I'll also verify all of the measurements that I have on the 'rough' plan, for final plate fabrication, and grade 8 bolt purchase.
I miss driving my Spider already,...! Hopefully this won't take too long.

[RRoller123]

Nice!

[wetminkey]

All would be great, except that I am unable to externally, or internally, compress the springs (not enough room/control arms interfere). I was able to compress three coils today, and wire them tight, and that has held. But I could not get any farther.
I've got it lowered now (onto wood blocks), to weight the springs, and have added four 80lb bags of concrete to the rad. mount and crossmember. So tomorrow I hope to raise one side at a time, and wire the springs tight, while compressed. I hope it will be enough for removal. Once out, I'll place my internal compressor on one, and the external ones on the other for storage - I'll not trust the wires for any period of time.
This would be no problem IF it was happening in my shop, but my Spider takes up space in a commercial shop right now! Owner is good with everything, of course,...but I know that the shop space = money!! I was hoping to just "whip" this out for him,...
Wish me luck!

[wetminkey]

Giant change in the state of things today! Yay! My part is done, the plan is settled on, and the 'ball is in Brady's court',...he's the frame professional.
Most dis-assembly occurred on Friday, and Monday was simply a flail,...not a single thing accomplished all day, other than to remove the torsion (sway) bar. FLAIL,...but just before I bought the four 80lb. sacks of concrete (to weight the empty engine bay, to wire the springs compressed), I found an old internal spring compressor with my old 'special tools'. It's kinda on the small size, and that made me think that it may have been what I used twenty years ago - bought from Midwest Bayless (Marieta, Georgia - a great business, gone out of business, long ago), a Fiat Spider parts vendor, twenty years ago,...
SPRING COMPRESSION:
Anyway, this morning I had the front of the car all weighted, and ready to go, when I decided to try the internal compressor, first. Had to dis-assemble it, and reassemble inside the spring,...and it required the spacers that I created on Monday (for the external compressors that WILL not work (due to space), but it compressed the spring nicely. HOWEVER,...due to the necessary spacers, it was impossible to remove my tool from inside the spring - it would have come apart well before the spring was at relaxed length (YIPES!). Anyway, after I wired the spring in several places, it occurred to me that I still had the borrowed (unused) external compressors. So I placed those on the driver's spring, retrieved my internal compressor, and repeated the process on the passenger's side. Both will remain compressed for installation.
WHEW!
Never did bust loose that R tie-rod end. the end of the bolt was beginning to bend, so I quit. Left it in place, with the spindle wired up inside the wheelwell, along with the brake caliper.
Then pulled the crossmember,...most everything was loose, so it was easy. And none of the hardware spun too much to get the nuts off,...(!)
Todd.

[wetminkey]

After some consultation with several folks, mutual decision was to eliminate the plate(s) alongside the inner framerail, and simplify the design to a "U bolt"-like arrangement of a top plate with bolts welded in place, passing through it. It will drop down through the tubes in the framerail. The bottom plate is still no more than a repair of the framerail metal in that area. The crossmember will handle a 7/16" bolt (even a 12mm, with some slight rasping, to cleanup the crossmember holes).
My crossmember has had one of the four lateral bolts repaired/replaced at one point (with an oddball course thread), but all is in good shape, and there are no fractures in the metal. Cleaned, primed, painted.
I pressure washed the TH180 auto tranny today. Doesn't look too bad - clean anyway. It goes for input, output, and selector shaft seals as soon as parts are delivered to me.
I have the tool and bushings to R&R the control arms. Onto replacing ball joints and tie rod ends,...

[dinghyguy]

i trust you are replacing the oddball horizontal bolt and using metric fasteners throughout. If not may the gods of previous bad owners descend upon your project and all your studs shear off. There is nothing, nothing more irritating that random bolts with the wrong threads in a project. Do it right please.

PS i have 2 extra spare horizontal bolts brand new in anticipation of having to fix some other PO who has done something similar.


dinghyguy in the still too small but much much nicer garage

[wetminkey]

Come on Dan-O,...you KNOW that I will build it right. Anything that needs to be replaced, is. Grade eight through-bolts will be used to attach the crossmember. The crossmember is quite serviceable, even with one 'stupid bolt'. And I wanna know HOW they got that welded in place!! I'll post a pic,...looks factory (but it can't be!). Crossmember horizontal bolts are in perfect shape, with no damage what so ever. Thread by hand after a thorough cleaning. As do the lower crossmember bolts/nuts.
I really believe that the car's entire history was centered in/around Denver, CO. I think the car was abused as a transportation machine, and was hit (and repaired) in the front on both sides,...worse along the driver's, and an impact behind driver's door. The car is repaired well (other than the BS attempt behind the L door, that I have fixed), and has been evaluated on an alignment rack to be straight. It NEARLY passed front end alignment, but failed because it would not hold the settings,...
Pic of the ready to re-install crossmember tomorrow - before I take it back to the shop for Brady's use in the repair.

[manoa matt]

I had to do that repair and used old cylinder head bolts to drop down through the frame rails. Correct length and plenty strong, they even say Fiat on the heads. I have a bunch of extras if you need them.

[wetminkey]

Interesting that the right, rear crossmember bolt has been replaced with a coarse thread bolt - I am unable to conceive how they did it,...the crossmember seems factory-intact:

Wish they had sourced another fine thread, for cripes' sake!
The heavy plate in the crossmember will take a 7/16" bolt (or a 12mm, with some light rasping). We will source some new grade eight bolts for the 'through-bolts' and weld them to the upper plate.
Ready to bust ball joints at the shop,...and, hopefully, tie rod ends!
I'll begin R&R of the control arm bushings tomorrow,...

[wetminkey]

COOL!
With my new tool from AR, control arm bushing removal and replacement is easy! Especially since I have both A-arms out of the car,...pressure washed, cleaned, painted, new bushings - ready to re-install.
Waiting for ball joints to arrive, so that I start putting things back together,...

[wetminkey]

Pics today,...
This is the driver's framerail, from below:

damage around the front crossmember stud.
This is the passenger's side:

Frractures around the front stud, with a fracture across the bottom of the framerail, and a deviation in the inner side of the rail. Fractures around the rear stud, also.
This will be cut out (extending slightly beyond the damage) and repaired with extra 'upper plate' material. Holes drilled to accommodate the crossmember's bolts.

[wetminkey]

Steering disassembly has taken a few days, but I finally got it all out, except the center link. My tie rod end breaker will not fit it,...working on an alternate method. My ball joint and tie rod end breakers have been the only 'special tools' that I've used so far,...
Passenger's outer tie rod end took removal from the car (rod, with the steering knuckle still attached), tie rod breaker in place (torqued as much as reasonable), lengthy penetrating oil soak, a borrowed pickle fork pounded in place, and some gentle heat from my torch. Then I gave the steering arm end one good wack with my larger ball pein, and it finally came apart. I put the tie rod end in the car only twenty years ago, and it froze that badly,...
The a-arm bushing tool from AR only does half of the job, BTW. Upper bushings have to be pounded out, and lowers have to be pounded in - not easy with the suspension out of the car,...I found that I could use a part of the tool, and a stack of washers, to remove the uppers without pounding,...not possible to install the lowers - they take pounding (and occasional realignment during the process) to install them. AR recommends that they be done with the lower a-arm installed in the car (to counteract the pounding required for installation). And the uppers are inserted deep enough "to fit snug" around the shock tower attachment - requiring occasional 'test fitting' of the a-arm during the installation,...I measured between the two, and inserted the bushings to that depth, since the car is 15 miles away.
A-arms and brake dust plates are cleaned and painted, ready for re-installation. Tranny is back from AAMCO with new seals all around. I've got yet to clean and paint tie rods, and install the new ends. New ball joints are in place on the knuckles.
The chore is getting done,...more soon.

[wetminkey]

Front suspension all cleaned (and brake dust shields bent 'straight'), painted, new joints and bushings, and ready for re-installation:

Tranny has new seals all around, engine is perfect, driveshaft/guibo is all new.
Now, if only Brady's shop wasn't so busy,...!

[wetminkey]

MERRY CHRISTMAS SPIDER!

Safely back in my garage again,...Cleaning/painting today. Preparing for tranny reinstallation,...perhaps tomorrow.
28 mph winds, and 26 degrees F this morning, as we loaded up to haul home - ICK! Better weather for the next few days,...
My body recovering from front suspension/steering reassembly on Monday/Tuesday,...I HATE COIL SPRINGS.
You can spot the repair/reinforcement plates/bolts in this pic:

Brady did his best to hide them.
Merry Christmas everyone!
Stay healthy!
More soon, Todd.