Coupe Dyno Run Results

[sptcoupe]

The coupe is back together and we just did the final dyno runs to get it street ready and get some miles on that 2.0L. More dyno runs will be done in the fall when we get a few thousand reasonably sane miles on it.

33 people submitted guesses as to the max RWHP we would get from this highly modified, custom FI engine. The one with the closest gets a case of beer of their choice. I am still confirming a few entries, but hope to post the winner tomorrow night or Thursday, as I am (as always) "on the road again".

The range of guesses was from 118 - 189. Remember, this is HP measured at the rear wheels. Of the 33 guesses, 27 were between 118 and 137 RWHP. The other 6 ran between 140 and 189 RWHP.

The max RWHP is 150.5 @ 6500 rpms. The torque is 144 lbs/foot @ 4600 rpms.

If you allow 20% efficiency loss in the drive train, then the motor is cranking out around 180 HP at he crank. At 10 percent loss, it is around 165 at the crank. The guys at the dyno shop say that a 10 year old Honda with FWD will lose about 15%. The driveline on the coupe has been refreshed, so you pick the HP at the crank. It runs really strong and revs like a banshee with all the lightening that was done (all pulleys and flywheel in aluminum, curillo rods, crank lightened and shaped, etc), and should only get better with some miles on it.

I have included some photos of the engine bay, without the aluminum-colored cam belt cover fitted.

Now we get some miles on her to get her ready for the FFO trip, and make whatever adjustments/mods we have to make as she gets broken in and lossens up. Then later in the fall we'll get her back on the dyno and test those curillo rods and forged aluminum pistons, big valves, 42/82 cams and Mark's header to 8000 rpms to see what she can really do.

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/ww21 ... ENGINE.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/ww21 ... NGINE3.jpg

http://i721.photobucket.com/albums/ww21 ... NGINE2.jpg

Jeff

[Danno]

lol, I missed it. That was exactly what I was gonna guess!!!! lol. Way cool engine. I'm very impressed.

[Zmatt]

Beautiful engine.

[So Cal Mark]

sounds like you got the airbox sorted out

[sptcoupe]

We did, and the loss with it closed up is minimal. We're trying a new filter anyway, just because these projects are never done!

One thing that was amazing was how a so-called hi-performance, baffled exhaust TIP (just the tip after the resonator)affected HP. We swapped out the old, dual tipped ones (which had rusted and the baffles had collapsed) for a single tip model. Imagine our surprise when the power dropped a full 20 RWHP! Off came the new tip, on went a new one with no baffles, and presto, we were in the money again. Beware what seemingly insignificant "performance" part you add to your engine/exhaust! And the more cam you have, the more sensitive your motor will be to exhaust pressure.

[htchevyii]

Boy, that thing is sweet AND fast!

[ventura ace]

Congratulations to you and Csaba for working out the bugs and getting that thing to perform! Do you plan to race it?

Alvon

[mdrburchette]

Glad you finally got that engine sorted out...now, if you'll just bring my case of beer to FFO this year, I'd appreciate it.

[baltobernie]

Congratulations on a terrific job! Looks great! (Probably sounds great, too!)
The benchmark for modern high-performance engines is 100hp/litre, and you're very close to that now, maybe already there with more tuning. And the modern engines have 4-valve heads, variable cam timing, etc. Aurelio really knew his stuff, huh? Not bad for a 50-year-old design!
Amazing what a dyno can show, isn't it?

[Zmatt]

Congratulations on a terrific job! Looks great! (Probably sounds great, too!)
The benchmark for modern high-performance engines is 100hp/litre, and you're very close to that now, maybe already there with more tuning. And the modern engines have 4-valve heads, variable cam timing, etc. Aurelio really knew his stuff, huh? Not bad for a 50-year-old design!
Amazing what a dyno can show, isn't it?

The motor stock has a very lazy tune. It doesn't surprise me that you can get 10hp/liter out of it. The Ferrari guys did that in 1962 with the GTO. Getting the power just requires a level of tune that the higher end ferraris were accustomed to from the start. Sure modern FI engines are easier to make powerful, but if you know what you are doing you can get anything powerful. I still want to know why they went through the trouble of a DOHC design if its only 8v? Seems like a waste to me.

[baltobernie]

I still want to know why they went through the trouble of a DOHC design if its only 8v? Seems like a waste to me.

Remember we're talking about a design that's 50 years old. The automobile is only 100 years old, so the 1960's is literally the Middle Ages. To put Lampredi's design in context: MG's of the era had farm tractor engines. Audi was still building cars with 2-stroke engines, etc. etc. Yes, Ferrari and a very few others were making 100 hp/litre, but nobody else sure was. The 283 Corvette of the era was renowned for making 1 hp/cubic inch, but that's only 61 hp/litre, and Mr. Duntov sure knew what he was doing!

The Fiat TC eventually did get a 4v head, fuel injection, turbocharging, supercharging, and so on, but the basic design was pretty damn good

[Zmatt]

I still want to know why they went through the trouble of a DOHC design if its only 8v? Seems like a waste to me.

Remember we're talking about a design that's 50 years old. The automobile is only 100 years old, so the 1960's is literally the Middle Ages. To put Lampredi's design in context: MG's of the era had farm tractor engines. Audi was still building cars with 2-stroke engines, etc. etc. Yes, Ferrari and a very few others were making 100 hp/litre, but nobody else sure was. The 283 Corvette of the era was renowned for making 1 hp/cubic inch, but that's only 61 hp/litre, and Mr. Duntov sure knew what he was doing!

The Fiat TC eventually did get a 4v head, fuel injection, turbocharging, supercharging, and so on, but the basic design was pretty damn good

I know it did eventually. But the hard part with multivalve is the cams, not the valves. I just don't see why they stopped short. I guess they either didn't think it was necessary or didn't do it for cost reasons. And yeah, by the time it was in the Lancia delta HF integrale it was pretty sophisticated.

[Redline]

Negligible gains for a huge increase in manufacturing costs for a mass-produced engine. The 1608 had 110 - 115 hp and good torque figures. The Dolomite Sprint was the first mass-produced 16V motor, I believe, in the early 70s. The first "big name" to offer one was the Toyota 4A-GE in the early 80s, and it was also only 115 - 120hp from 1.6l and quite poor torque. When the first VW 16V motor came out, you could do much better building a big-valve 8V motor. Everyone was fascinated by the hp values of the VW 16V motor (which were actually very poor), but on the road, the big-valve 8V would just eat it for breakfast, especially if you weren't on top of the gears. I think a 16V head wouldn't have added that much to the experience.

[Zmatt]

Negligible gains for a huge increase in manufacturing costs for a mass-produced engine. The 1608 had 110 - 115 hp and good torque figures. The Dolomite Sprint was the first mass-produced 16V motor, I believe, in the early 70s. The first "big name" to offer one was the Toyota 4A-GE in the early 80s, and it was also only 115 - 120hp from 1.6l and quite poor torque. When the first VW 16V motor came out, you could do much better building a big-valve 8V motor. Everyone was fascinated by the hp values of the VW 16V motor (which were actually very poor), but on the road, the big-valve 8V would just eat it for breakfast, especially if you weren't on top of the gears. I think a 16V head wouldn't have added that much to the experience.

It all depends on how aggressive the tune is. The wimpy versions of the 4age only had 115hp. The MR2 made 140hp, and the 4A-GE can easily be tuned to 180hp and up for far less money than older 8v engines.

[Redline]

It was simply an example. 15 years after Fiat mass-produced a 1.6L 8V motor with 115hp, Toyota mass produced a 1.6L 16V motor (with TVIS and fuel injection) that produced 115 - 120hp. The tuning potential of each wasn't the question, the question was simply "why didn't they go all the way to 16V?" and the answer was that the potential gains would not have justified the cost.